The top TV characters meme lives on! Stu_N has added his list to the mix; Marie's crafted a much-admired 'women only' list; and there are other suggestions in the comments list of the original meme.
In addition to my original 20, we've now added
21) Stringer Bell from The Wire
22) Stewie Griffin of Family Guy (thanks Rosby!)
Stu_N has tempted me with David Callan, Will Scarlet and Steel, but I'm still not sure they're great characters. I'm half-tempted to add Robert de Rainault - aka the Sheriff of Nottingham from Robin of Sherwood – simply because he was:
a) clever, unlike every other version of the Sheriff of Nottingham so far (and I suspect to come)
b) able to kill Robin Hood. Yes, kill him, stone dead. Well, technically, “so filled with crossbow bolts then trampled by horses that we couldn't stick his head on a pike outside Nottingham castle because no one would recognise him” dead.
But I've decided not to. Again, good but not great. Still Stu_N and Marie both had one name in common on their lists, which has prompted me to come up with a 23 and a 24 for my list.
Drum roll (humour me)...
At 23, we have Liz Shaw from Doctor Who; and at 24, we have, from The Avengers... Cathy Gale.
Who they? I'm glad you asked. Because in both 23 and 24's cases we have a similar thing happening. We have two pioneering, feminist characters whom everyone's forgotten, in favour of two not-quite-so feminist characters.
Let me alpha nerd you for a moment...
Liz Shaw: Old-school Doctor Who fans will cite Sarah Jane Smith as the first “feminist character”. A few will cite Zoe, who was allegedly smarter than the Doctor, but frankly all she did was scream a lot while wearing a sparkly cat suit. But four seasons before Sarah Jane came along and started refusing to make coffee for the Doctor and demanding that everyone take her seriously, Liz Shaw was simply making everyone take her seriously.
A few comparison points for you
- Liz Shaw got hired as scientific advisor to the most important military operation in the country because she was pretty much the smartest human being in Britain at the time. Sarah Jane… wasn't.
- Almost all Doctor Who companions scream. Liz Shaw screamed once - it was more like a yelp actually - when she was pushed off a bridge towards a raging weir. Sarah Jane screamed every single episode (disclaimer: may not actually be true, but it felt like it)
- In her first story, Liz Shaw saved the whole world and the Doctor by fixing the very complicated piece of alien machinery the Doctor had built using her brain, rather than twatting it one with a mallet; he was indisposed, being attacked by an alien octopus thing, so Liz Shaw saved the day. Sarah Jane once talked a robot that had fallen in love with her into almost giving up. Once. Oh yeah, and in that spin-off series, she beat up a market gardener.
- The only time Liz Shaw was ever captured by baddies, it was because they were specifically trying to abduct her - she was the only one smart enough to do the things they needed doing. Sarah Jane was abducted every story as a recreational sport.
As you can see, Liz Shaw much better and a far more feminist character than basically any other companion before and after. Including Ace and Rose Tyler. She also a good sense of humour, spending most of the time taking the piss out of the Doctor and the Brigadier. Plus she went to Cambridge. So there.
Yet completely forgotten in favour of Sarah Jane! Oh the injustice of it all
Speaking of injustice, here comes Cathy Gale. Again, everything everyone loves about Emma Peel, more or less, was done better and before by Cathy Gale.
Most people haven't heard of her though. That's not totally surprising: all her episodes were black and white (as were the first load of Emma Peel episodes, before the stonking big injection of American money that glammed everything up); they're rarely repeated and quite a few of them were used by Lew Grade to light his cigars with anyway; and they have a jazz theme tune that quite rightly all sensible people shun. They were also a little more grown up than the more escapist Peel episodes so don't quite capture the imagination (ie garner nerd love) the way the more crime-oriented Cathy Gale episodes did.
Still, she fares better in the memory than Venus Smith, Dr Martin King and Dr David Keel, Steed's other companions for the first two series of The Avengers. They were just rubbish.
Yet, apart from having a more charismatic, slightly posher, slightly prettier actress playing her (although Honor Blackman was pretty charismatic/posh/pretty herself), Cathy Gale was better than Emma Peel because
- She had a sensible name. What's silly about Emma Peel? It's short for “Man appeal”. Seriously. The producers (well, one of their PAs, in fact) thought “we need someone with man appeal... 'M' appeal... Emma Peel!” A character whose main aim was to appeal to men. Huh.
- Emma Peel was supposed to be able to do Kung Fu. Diana Rigg couldn't. So they just got a load of stunt men to fall over in response to some rather feeble kicks and strikes. Watch any Peel fight scene and laugh at it, my friends. Now watch a Cathy Gale fight scene and remember it was broadcast live. Honor Blackman was a yellow belt in judo at the time, having been taught that - and some stuff too nasty for TV - by a member of the French Resistance. Every one of those fight scenes she did on the night, live, before rushing off to do the next scene. She fractured one bloke's collar bone - he still had to carry on with the scene... And while Emma Peel inspired a whole load of women to buy her dresses (see below), Cathy Gale inspired a whole load of women to buy her clothes - and to learn judo.
- Leather outfits. Pioneered by Cathy Gale. When you're doing judo live on national television, you need an outfit that doesn't rip easily
- Self-made woman. She was an anthropologist who married a farmer in Africa and there learned to hunt, fight and take care of herself. When her husband was killed, Gale returned to London to earn a Ph.D. in anthropology. She was the curator of a museum when she first encountered Steed. Emma Peel? Got her money from Daddy.
- Sparkling, flirty dialogue and sexual tension? Cathy Gale got there first. She even lived in Steed's flat for a while
- Cathy Gale actually had arguments with Steed and objected to his methods. Mrs Peel? “He likes his tea stirred anti-clockwise”. Bah!
- Getting captured and in need of being rescued? Cathy Gale - not much; Mrs Peel - quite a lot.
So there we go. Two pioneers who just go to prove that even great female characters get forgotten about, while even quite insipid men seem to linger on in our collective consciousness. What's up there, I ask again?
Now all I've got to do is come up with number 25. Maybe I should make that Mrs Peel. No reason why they can't both be in there, even if Cathy Gale is better.
Oh dear. This is going to be hard...
Updates and related entries
August 29, 2006: I've come up with number 25 now.
October 31, 2006:
Why Liz Shaw had to leave Doctor Who
March 5, 2007:
My review of The Companion Chronicles - The Blue Tooth
August 28, 2006 | Reply
Good additions, and I HAD heard of both of them and caught them on re-showings etc. Bravo!
August 28, 2006 | Reply
Ta. And I'm glad they're not completely forgotten. Let us spread the word!
August 29, 2006 | Reply
Just thought you might like to know your thoughts on Liz Shaw have been mentioned (and credited) on the LiveJournal Doctor Who Group. Seem to have gone down rather well.
August 29, 2006 | Reply
Well, just because there was one feminist character, doesn't mean there can't be another. There are different types of strong women and different types of feminism - OK, sometimes Sarah screamed and got kidnapped, but sometimes she brought women's lib to other planets and tried to start a feminist revolution in the middle ages! Give the girl some credit. Plus, I'll repeat what a lot of people at the LJ comm have said - tearing down one woman just to build up another isn't really furthering the cause of feminism.
August 29, 2006 | Reply
Yes, I saw. It's true: you can't be ironic on the Internet without people getting the wrong end of the stick sometimes. Oh well.
Just to clarify then: when I said "We have two pioneering, feminist characters whom everyone's forgotten, in favour of two not-quite-so feminist characters", I meant that Emma Peel and Sarah Jane were less feminist, not that they weren't feminist at all. Yes, they undoubtedly had their feminist moments - quite a few in fact - and were strong women, etc, etc, But they have a reputation for being the most or the first feminist characters, despite there being predecessors who were IMHO stronger and better-defined characters. I agree that tearing down one woman for another isn't an especially feminist act, but it's very very hard to say "this character is more feminist than another" to illustrate this point without explaining why the other is less feminist. You could try a statistical approach, but I'm not sure it would be as interesting. So forgive my flippancy everyone.
And just to answer a few more comments to save myself from having to get a LiveJournal account:
"He puts Captain "show me this Earth thing you call kissing" Kirk (aka intergalatic James Bond) in his list of favourite characters which IMO blows any feminist cred clean out of the window."
I'm saying he's a great character, not that he was a great example of feminism in action. Just to head off further issues: I don't endorse the mass-murder of Callisto, the shooting of his own girlfriend by Neil Burnside, the mass execution of Russians of Stringfellow Hawke, the bad dumping technique of Chandler, the bedside manner of Gregory House, the vengeance demoning of Anya, the Pon Farring of Spock, the management skills of Lynda Day, the general psychopathy of Avon, or the agoraphobia of Austin James. Sorry if it wasn't clear this was a characters list, rather than a "people whose behaviour I 100% endorse list".
"Sounds to me like this guy has Joss Whedon's "feminist characters are barbies with dicks" syndrome."
Never watched a Cathy Gale episode of The Avengers, have you? She's not exactly Barbie. Lynda Day a Barbie with a dick? Liz Shaw a particularly masculine character was she? And I think it was noticeable that I didn't include Buffy in the list. Feminism is a many varied thing but the two characters at 23 and 24 weren't included because they were feminist characters: they were included because they were great characters; I just thought it was interesting that they highlighted a particular issue, namely that great feminist characters often get forgotten and overshadowed by characters that aren't quite so feminist.
"Actually, Liz screams more than that. Cliffhanger to part two of The Silurians."
You can't hear her scream; she just opens her mouth. At least on my copy. But that was 15 years ago and my memory may be cheating me. I did do a Liz Shaw scream count at the time and I only ended up with one. Actually, that may have been it and I may have discounted the Ambassadors of Death tumble.
"Au contraire, she only screamed in The Mind Robber"
Really? Could have sworn it was more than that, but it's been a while since I watched her stories, too, so I'm probably wrong there. Are you really, really sure?
"Oh for God's sake - Rose's is 19 and the first cut is the deepest - cut her some slack."
No. Shan't. Can't make me.
August 29, 2006 | Reply
My concern is about privileging one kind of feminist behaviour over another - it's essentially self-defeating, because it doesn't allow space for two women to be equally strong. Maybe that's not what you were going for, but it's a trap that's easy to fall into. That said, I agree that Liz and Cathy deserve more recognition.
August 29, 2006 | Reply
Can I just point out I'm not with her?
August 29, 2006 | Reply
"My concern is about privileging one kind of feminist behaviour over another" - it's essentially self-defeating, because it doesn't allow space for two women to be equally strong."
Well, you're certainly right there. There's nothing worse than one of those particular matches. I operate a far simpler method that cuts through all that: they get marks off every time they make my eyes roll; at the end of the story, they get a percentage for their overall onscreen eye-rolling time.
So Sarah Jane is less feminist within my system than Liz Shaw because she made me roll my eyes in despair at getting captured, screaming, etc far more times per episode than Liz Shaw did. But Sarah Jane does better than Peri, say.
Feel free to use the same system if you want. It's not copyrighted.
August 29, 2006 | Reply
"Can I just point out I'm not with her?"
Feel free, and thanks for your support!
I'm just here to entertain. Or try to. Everyone's welcome here. Except maybe the Grintologists. I might think twice about them.
August 29, 2006 | Reply
Now I've thought about it, doesn't Zoe scream when she's down in the sewers with the Cybermen in Invasion?
And does spectral Zoe count in The Five Doctors? Spectral Liz Shaw just does an elongated "Stop him!"
August 29, 2006 | Reply
Ooh, and just in case you missed the other bit of "I'm not guilty, m'lud" evidence, read the end of the piece:
"Now all I've got to do is come up with number 25. Maybe I should make that Mrs Peel. No reason why they can't both be in there, even if Cathy Gale is better.
August 29, 2006 | Reply
Point taken, but I just find this too strong: "Liz Shaw much better and a far more feminist character than basically any other companion before and after." Like I said, I think those kind of comparisons aren't really constructive. Anyway, just reposting a comment I made on lj. I either read or heard an interview with Elisabeth Sladen where she talked about how much she screamed as Sarah, and she made the point that if you're being menaced by a giant scary alien, screaming your head off is actually a pretty logical course of action. And it doesn't automatically mean, 'oh, big strong man come and save me!' - it can also mean 'holy FUCK, that's a giant scary alien', or 'get the hell away from me!' I think you can make a pretty compelling argument that a blanket criticism of the screaming actually supresses the female voice, as well as being an attempt to silence or belittle perfectly natural emotions that just happen to be labelled 'feminine'. OK, so sometimes beating the crap out of a dalek with a baseball bat is going to do more direct good, but the voice can also be a weapon, and some of these women had pretty powerful lungs!
August 29, 2006 | Reply
"but I just find this too strong: "Liz Shaw much better and a far more feminist character than basically any other companion before and after." Like I said, I think those kind of comparisons aren't really constructive."
I'm guessing you don't do too many lists like these then? ;-)
"a blanket criticism of the screaming actually supresses the female voice"
Is the female voice screaming? Discuss.
Actually, I know plenty of women who yelp in surprise, shock, fear, etc. I don't know any that scream. Not seriously anyway. It could be argued therefore that screaming women are a male dramatic construction. Women who argue that women screaming in drama is perfectly normal have in fact therefore been brainwashed into accepting a patriarchal "folklore" that has no basis in reality and are actually arguing against women's true voice.
I'm just messing with you. ;-)
August 29, 2006 | Reply
:p Hey - for what it's worth, I really appreciate the fact that a guy is taking the time to discuss feminist characters in sci fi. It's not something I see a lot - which doesn't mean that it doesn't happen, of course. Maybe these days women are afraid to just yell out like that, because they've been told that it's weak, when really the problem is that they're making too much noise already. Maybe it would do us good to have a big, full-blooded scream sometimes. But only at sensible things, like daleks, or creepy frankenstein-esque hosts for the brain of Morbius. Maybe men should scream more, too!
August 30, 2006 | Reply
"Maybe men should scream more, too!"
Nah. I find it takes up too much valuable running-away time.
August 30, 2006 | Reply
To be fair to Rob, and I am an ardent feminist, these women are't real women - they're female characters, played by female actressses but frequently invented by male producers and written by male screenwriters. It's not denigrating real woman to point out if some display more "feminist" traits than others. It's perfectly rational to imagine some script meeting where a bunch of blokes say 'That Mrs Peel. Very pretty, but we think she's a bit strident. Maybe she should get captured a bit more often?' The fact that the later women are often more patriarchy-friendly makes perfect sense if you read Susan Faludi's brilliant feminist book 'Backlash'. Having said that, I don't remember Liz Shaw or Cathy Gale (am way too young) so can't comment on these specific instances.
August 30, 2006 | Reply
Why thank you kindly for your defence, Marie!
"I don't remember Liz Shaw or Cathy Gale (am way too young)"
Me, too. I caught them on re-runs, etc. But you're way too young to remember Emma Peel from her mid-60s original run, too.
So (he asks in a general sort of way rather than looking at anyone in particular) how is it that you do remember her and remember her well enough to include her in your own list, yet can't remember Cathy Gale? I'm guessing you saw the Channel 4 repeats in the mid 80s (or not) which didn't include any Cathy Gale episodes. Why didn't it, is the question?
See? It's all a great big backlashy conspiracy. Or not.
August 31, 2006 | Reply
Yes, mid-80s re-runs for me. I would have been about 10 - just the right age to start hero-worshiping Mrs Peel.
Who-wise, I hardly remember anything at all, though I did watch. The only bits that made the remotest lasting impression on me were the excellent Doctor outfits, Ace, and a sharply attuned awareness that the indoor sets were really bad but somehow when they went outside they were always just in some field which was even worse.